Matchpoints on king of the hill HL ruleset

#1848
Topic created · 5 Posts · 50 Views
  • I think that the match points on koth should share a distribution with the stopwatch ones. In highlander we only play koth and stopwatch, the two should be normalized to the diminutive variable and 2 KOTH rounds (1 half) should grant 1 match point. Here is a distribution that would better approximate 3 MP shared between the two teams, as compared to the previous system.

    488375c3-b093-4851-8f97-f4dc55c3785b-image.png

    tldr 4-2 KOTH and 2-1 STOPWATCH should be equal in matchpoints

  • @Mothership ill give you a hat if you run stats on this data for playoffs seeding in invite seasons 1-9

  • @calo said in Matchpoints on king of the hill HL ruleset:

    @Mothership ill give you a hat if you run stats on this data for playoffs seeding in invite seasons 1-9

    Doing that would not necessarily help since the way the league ranks teams might of changed multiple times since season 1.


    Current system:

    alt text

    This is the official math on how points are given out. to break this into a formula, we would say this:

    (Loser Points)    L=x/(y-1)
    (Winner Points)   W=3-L
                      3=L+W
    

    So if we were to plug in the Koth info, we would get this: (Only showing the loser points math as I hope we can all do W=3-L on our own.)

    Score |  MP          | Math
     4-0    3-0             0=0/(4-1)         
     4-1    2.66-.33      1/3=1/(4-1)
     4-2    2.33-.66      2/3=2/(4-1)
     4-3    2-1             1=3/(4-1)
    

    As you can see, the winning team’s rounds for koth is always four, so the math for the original formula is simplified to [Loser score]/3 or, Rounds won times 0.33


    Lets also test this with Payload.

    Score |  MP | Math
     2-0    3-0   0=0/(2-1)         
     2-1    2-1   1=1/(2-1)
    

    So we can simply the Payload formula to (Loser score/1) or even more simply Loser MP = Loser Score.


    Using a Different Formula:

    Now to to make the koth 4-2 be the same match points as payload 2-1 would require us changing the formula completely. This is ignoring if the community agrees that 4-2 on koth is the same as 2-1 on payload.

    IDK what math you are using to dist. in your doodle. But the only way to get a flat distribution like what you are wanting is by dist the final points based off if the losing team got 1/3 of the total rounds in the game. Leading to this formula:

    Loser MP = 3(Loser rounds won)/(Total rounds played)

    Basically, you want to gain one (1) MP off winning one third (1/3) of the total rounds played.

    Score |  MP     | Math
     4-0     3-0        0=3(0/4)
     4-1   2.4-.6     3/5=3(1/5)
     4-2     2-1        1=3(2/6)
     4-3  1.71-1.29   9/7=3(3/7)
    
     2-0     3-0         0=3(0/2)
     2-1     2-1         1=3(1/3)
    

    This has the fun side-effect of having proportionally decreasing MP gained as you win more rounds as the losing team.

    R:    MP:    Change:    Diff:
    0     0      +0         +0
    1     0.6    +0.6       +0.6
    2     1      +0.4       -0.2
    3     1.29   +0.29      -0.11
    

    Applying the New Formula to Season 10:

    Current league standings are as such:
    alt text

    Rank    Team            Pts
    1       Hood           11.34
    2       WJQ308          9.33
    3       FroggieLand	9
    4	3600	        9
    5	Yeye	        5.33
    6	somebody help   3
    7	Amigos    	1
    8	Train Station	0
    

    This would change to:

    Rank    Team            Pts
    1       Hood           11
    2       WJQ308          9.4
    3       FroggieLand	9
    4	3600	        9
    5	Yeye	        5.31
    6	somebody help   3
    7	Amigos    	1.29
    8	Train Station	0
    

    Basically nothing for this current season would change.


    Applying the New Formula to Season 9:

    Lets try this again with last season however just for shits and giggles.
    alt text

    Rank    Team                Pts
    1       Don't Press Tab     20.34
    2       Man Crush Monday    13.67
    3       Froggie Land	    12.68
    4	RunItBack            9.34
    5	Yatch Club           9.34
    6	somebody help        8.66
    7	Yeye                 6.32
    8	Goose Lagoon	     3.65
    

    The new formula would change to This:

    Rank    Team                Pts
    1       Don't Press Tab     20
    2       Man Crush Monday    13.4
    3       Froggie Land	    12
    4	RunItBack            9 
    5	Yatch Club           9  
    6	somebody help        9
    7	Yeye                 7
    8	Goose Lagoon	     4.6
    

    The change in this case is that RunItBack, Yacht Club, and Somebody Help would all now have the same MP, but all with different records.

    In the case of last season, this would not result in any change in the regular season rankings, and thus would not affect playoffs. THIS TIME!


    What about a different formula?

    The issue resolves around the fact that the current system rewards 1 match point to the winner of the match and then divides the rest of the points based off rounds.

    If you make koth 4-2 = 2-1 in MP, then 4-3 would have to give more than 1 MP to the losing team. This means you cannot award extra points to the winning team because there would not be enough points to give away to make 4-2 = 2-1 in MP.

    This means that my formula is the best (that I could think of at 2am) alternative that we could use. HOWEVER:


    Final Conclusion

    One thing everyone should keep in mind is that HL does rankings on MP and not win/loss. This means that it is completely possible for a team to rank higher than another team while having a worse Win/Loss record. And this formula, would increase the amount of points a losing team gains via rounds taken, and thus exponentially increases the chance of this happening.

    It honestly comes down to if we think that one payload round is equal to two koth rounds (currently its equal to three). Which I personally do not as it is much easier to take 2 koth rounds than it is to take a full payload/stopwatch round.


    Data:


  • seems like nothing would change but it seems weird to me that the third round is worth less points than the first two, i feel like they should have equal point values. maybe .4 per round? idk

  • @dlphn said in Matchpoints on king of the hill HL ruleset:

    seems like nothing would change but it seems weird to me that the third round is worth less points than the first two, i feel like they should have equal point values. maybe .4 per round? idk

    The third round is not worth less than the first two, all the rounds won have diminishing returns. You get .6 for the first round, .4 for the second, and then .29 for the third.

    This is because we are taking the loser rounds won and dividing by the total rounds played. For koth, the winner will always have 4 rounds won, so you are basically doing a fun line graph of y=3x/(4+x). As you win more rounds, the number you are dividing by also increases.
    alt text

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