Potential Balance changes discussion Doc

#1807
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  • With over 8,000 hours in tf2, playing many versions of tf2, playing many different game modes, both official and community made, also played highlander for over 12 seasons, and have played countless matches of MvM, (mostly boot camp with friends and community pugs, with all my time playing this game, as well as reading up on it, listening to others, watching YouTube videos from popular and unpopular content creators alike, I like to imagine I’ve got a decent idea on what issues their are in this game, as well as some ideas on how the community and I would like to see them fixed, now I understand that im likely biased in many different ways, but I dare you to find a person who isn’t, is every one of these ideas a good idea? probably not, Ive gone back and forth thinking and rethinking about many of these ideas, and often good intentions and good ideas can evolve into poor fixes for the issues at hand, regardless, being someone who has spent 2 years doing a game design class, has watched countless videos from the game design youtuber crew “extra credits” played around with hammer, and in general is a fairly analytical person, I hope you all don’t write me off too quickly before reading through these suggestions.
    Should you happen to disagree, or have an idea of your own im often happy to hear it, just don’t be disheartened when im not sold on your idea, or I decide its best to agree to disagree.

    With all that being said, it is quite possible I’ve under or over nerfed/buffed classes and weapons, it can often be hard to tell how strong something is without being able to easily test them in a test client.
    Continuing on, I know there are weapons that are under powered and over powered that I haven’t touched on here, this is because outside of a few weapons I don’t want to nerf a weapon that is overpowered without making it interesting in some way, or reworking it in some way, as for buffing, I don’t want to needlessly buff weapons which some people enjoy using purely because of / in spite of the fact that they are bad, I also don’t want to ruining a play style through buffing / reworking an underpowered weapon cough Pre-Jungle Inferno Your Eternal Reward cough, and lastly I want to state that not everything needs to be perfectly balanced, the game would arguably be boring if everything was balanced, part of what makes the game fun is overcoming another player using a better weapon than you, and it’s okay to have weak weapons, its okay to have meme weapons, it’s okay to have weapons be situationally stronger, such as on specific maps or only at the highest of skill levels.

    PS: I would rather more frequent smaller updates over bigger and bigger updates, but this whole thing is stylized as “one big update”

    The Spy
    The Spy, the class I believe I have the most traction on, I have over 300 hours (too many hours) on this class alone, and have played 13 seasons of highlander overall the spy is the weakest class in the game, and that is fine in my eyes, in fact id agree with the people who believe he should always be the weakest, but that doesn’t mean the spy doesn’t have a few issues that need working out, and as such these are the solutions to the issues I believe he has.

    Baseline
    (+) now runs at 330 (110%) hammer units per second (up from 320 hmu/s or 307%)
    The biggest buff knife focused spies needs is a buff to his movement speed. The faster the spy moves the faster he can escape from bad situations, the faster he can catch up to people he is behind, the larger distances he can cover while invisible, and most importantly, being able to move faster than the medic (his primary focus in 6s, and secondary focus in highlander and prolander) would be massive. The biggest worry with this buff is that getting strafe and snaps, matador’s, back pedal stabs, and trickstabs in general will be slightly easier to do, and whilst I can see why, the real counter to getting trickstabbed like this is your own movement, not the the spies movement.

    Revolvers!

    All Revolvers
    (+) Removed Random Bullet Spread (all shots are perfectly accurate)
    I dislike R.N.G in any game im going to invest significant amounts of time in, I never want to have a strategy fail not because it was a bad strategy, or because it was hard to pull off or the enemy predicted / outplayed it, but because a random number generator said it wouldn’t work, this is especially annoying when your shooting at people who aren’t moving, or buildings that cant move, especially when its a small hit box on a mini sentry / teleporter, and especially when you randomly miss 2-3 shots in a row because of spread and then the engineer makes a clutch wrench swing against said building saving it and possibly making a big impact all because of RANDOMNESS.
    Note: server owners can decide in their own server settings whether or not Revolvers have Random spread (like how they can decide on shotgun bloom)

    The Ambassador
    Note: this is a complete reversion to the PRE-Jungle Inferno Ambassador
    (+) critical hits no longer have fall off
    (+) you can now headshot past 1200 hammer units
    (?) add the headshot cool down hidden stat to the stats
    I do not believe the nerf was required, at all, not even a little bit, as such im undoing it completely.
    NOTE: I am removing bullet spread on all revolvers, including the ambassador, but the ambassador will sill have the 0.95 second headshot cool down that is currently tied to the bullet spread.

    The Enforcer
    (+) Removed slower firing rate
    (+) pierces sapped sentry resistances
    (+) +20% damage to buildings
    (+) now correctly deals bonus damage to the Pain Train
    (-) -20% damage to players
    (-) Removed bonus damage while disguised
    This is to refine the niche the enforcer currently has as an anti building gun.
    Ever since the enforcer was nerfed from being a direct upgrade to the stock revolver the enforcer has been in a weird place, right now its in a weird semi anti wrangler position, that can also randomly 2 shot razorback snipers, on top of that I believe spy is the weakest class against engineers out of the classes that are meant to counter engineer (Demoman, medic, soldier, and spy) so hopefully this is a buff to spy that also refines the niche the enforcer currently has as an anti wrangler / turtle engi gun, which should help speed up the game

    The Diamondback
    (-) saved critical hits now only deal mini crits
    The current diamondback is overpowered, cheap, unfun to play against and honestly unfun to use, unless your either new to the game, or enjoy abusing how cheap and overpowered it is. I’m removing most of these issues, leaving it with just being unfun to use, though it could be argued that with it no longer feeling cheap to use, that it would be more fun, I doubt it but it could be the case.
    Note: The diamondback minicrits for 69 damage at point blank, barely more than stock, but notably high enough to 2 shot light classes, but only with 2 saved minicrits as 69 + 51 is only 120 damage, at long range the diamondback minicrits for 46 damage, which isn’t bad, and lets you 3 shot light classes, but nowhere near as cheap or overpowered as the weapon currently is.
    Note 2: This will be the 1st weapon to have stored minicrits as opposed to stored crits.

    Sappers!

    The Sapper
    (?) the spy now flicks one of the switches when he pulls it out
    (thanks tf2classic)

    The Red Tape Recorder
    (+) +10 hmu/s on wearer (113.33% speed or 340 Hammer units per second)
    (-) no longer de-levels sapped buildings
    (-) no longer deconstructs sapped buildings
    (-) sapped buildings can be destroyed by the engineer with his destruction PDA

    Knives!

    The Your Eternal Reward
    Note: This is a complete reversion to the PRE-Jungle Inferno Your Eternal Reward.
    (+) Removed Increase Cloak Drain Rate
    (-) Can No Longer Disguise

    The Big Earner
    (?) The spy now presses in the button to cause the switch blade to extend

    The Sharp Dresser
    (+) Add a taunt kill animation
    a dozen ideas come to mind, and im sure any fan of the assassin’s creed series could think of half a dozen themselves

    Disguise Kit!

    The Disguise Kit
    (+) The Spies Disguise will now appear to be marked for death when the disguise is holding a weapon that marks the user for death
    (+) The Spies disguised run speed is now affected by speed altering items and takes all variables into consideration
    The spy can not run faster than his undisguised speed.
    Example: The escape plan now increases the spies speed based on the health of the disguise, and also now makes the disguised
    spy appear to be marked for death, should the disguise gain health in some way, the spy will also slow down to show the gain
    of health, however even at 1 disguise health the spy could not run faster than his movement speed while undisguised
    this is all to buff to spies disguise believability, because even the best actor in the world cant deal with the fact that
    being disguised as a soldier with the escape plan wont show you as marked for death
    (+) while disguised as an enemy player it will tell you the the weapon the disguise has, NOT the (re)name the weapon has
    this change is primarily for competitive where checking enemy weapons is important, it and while you can work around this with custom huds, and by using 3d disguise models, it restricts the options spies have when it comes to customizing their game

    (+) pressing the reload key while holding your knife allows you to toggle the ability to run at full speed while disguised
    Note: you can switch weapons while walking at full speed while disguised without slowing down
    This is an interesting idea I’ve seen a few times, seeing how it actually plays in game though would be interesting, personally I think it gives spies more options when it comes to getting stabs and trickstabs, and makes being disguised less punishing.

    Invis-Watchs!

    ALL invis Watches

    The Deadringer
    (+) Able to pick up metal at a 70% rate
    (+) Deadringer Resistance after the initial attack increased to 75% (up from 65%)
    (+) now removes ALL debuffs (slows, bleeds, fire, jarate, Mad Milk, Gas passer)
    (+) now correctly shows the spy dying in the kill feed when triggered by weapons which count attacks in the kill feed
    (+) ammo boxes dropped by feigned spies will now give metal to everyone but the spy who feigned his death (similar to how mini’s give metal to everyone but the engineer)
    (?) Feigned Deaths will now Trigger “On Kill” Attributes such as healing with the half zatoichi
    (-) No longer granted a speed boost on feign
    This is to make the dead ringer more viable (especially in competitive) whilst also reducing the frustration of constantly chasing a spy around the map, whilst on the more casual side of things it should allow spies to more convincingly feign their death, as well as help feel less frustrating for those who dislike the deadringer (since if you believe the spy died you wont be annoyed with having to chase the spy)

    New Invis-Watch
    The Rogue Opperative
    (+) temporary speed boost on cloak (speed boost persists if you decloak)
    (+) cloaking is instant
    (+) +40% cloak duration
    (+) Resistance while cloaked increased from 20% to 50%, this then rapidly lowers back to 20% over the course of the speed boost
    (-) can not pick up metal while cloaked
    (-) can not cloak unless at full cloak
    (-) activating cloak uses half of your cloaking meter
    (-) loud decloak sound
    (-) leaves behind a puff of smoke when cloaking (this smoke follows you, similar to disguise smoke)
    Like the old equalizer being split into 2 weapons im doing the same with the dead ringer, many spies enjoy the current deadringer for its ability to grant them easier trickstabs and in general faster movement capabilities, this watch is to grant spies those capabilities.
    the smoke should be fairly small, and brief and translucent, its not meant to obstruct vision, and is more meant to show that the spy has cloaked, and also counter the spies ability to “run away” for free that many people complain about with the current Deadringer, as such it incentivizes the spy to de cloak and fight

    Multi-Class

    Water
    (+) added water effect to camera to indicate when wet from water
    (-) water droplets are now visible on players wet via water
    this achieves 2 things
    1st it allows players to know when they or someone else is wet to avoid the neon annihilator / know if they can crit with the neon annihilator
    2nd it lets spies know if they’re truly invisible or not

    ALL Shotgun’s
    (+) removed random pellet spread
    Note: community servers can still decide per their own server settings if shotguns have random “bloom” or not

    New Shotgun (usable by Pyro, Soldier, Heavy and Engineer)
    The Beggars Boomstick
    Notes: this is completely identical to the Pre Jungle Inferno Panic Attack
    (+) +30% fire rate
    (+) +50% reload speed
    (+) +50% switch to speed
    (+) increased fire rate at lower health
    (+) increased reload rate at lower health
    (-) increased spread at lower health
    (-) Loads clip similar to the beggars bazooka
    (+) full clip does not auto fire
    I liked the old pre jungle inferno panic attack, I also understand the current panic attack is a fun combo weapon for Soldiers and Pyros, and has a few uses for Engineer as such I’m creating a new weapon that is the old panic attack.
    Note: would be cool if its modeled after a “ye olde” rifle, with the rounds being loaded into the front of the barrel one at a time

    The Righteous Bison
    (+) can now be equipped by the Pyro, Heavy, and Engineer as a replacement to their shotgun
    (+) increased particle hitbox size
    Notes: please watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7q6iDtP2ePk
    The righteous bison isn’t a strong weapon by any means, and it has a strong cult following, as such I think sharing this fun weapon with a few other classes would be fine and fun
    Lastly the particle size change is simply to revert the bison properly as it was incorrectly reverted in jungle inferno.

    The Pomson
    (+) can be used by the Soldier, Pyro, and Heavy as a shotgun replacement
    (+) projectile passes through team mates
    (+) removed reduced clip size (this stat is hidden)
    (+) removed reduced firing rate (this stat is hidden)
    (-) removed draining spies cloak or medics uber charge on hit

    ALL melee weapons
    (+) melee weapons now pierce through team mates
    this will fix a rather annoying feature of melee weapons that is especially prevalent in medieval mode

    The Scout
    The Scout is a very powerful class in the right hands, and also the current meta in 6’s whether or not people like it or not is besides the point, regardless I don’t want to shift around a meta that I don’t entirely understand, so Ive only really touched weapons that are banned in 6s or would never be used in 6s in the 1st place.

    Primaries!

    ALL Scatterguns
    (+) Removed Random Pellet Spread
    Note: community servers can still decide per their own server settings if shotguns and scatterguns have random “bloom” or not
    I dislike R.N.G in any game im going to invest significant amounts of time in, I never want to have a strategy fail not because it was a bad strategy, or because it was hard to pull off or the enemy predicted / outplayed it, but because a random number generator said it wouldn’t work, this is especially annoying when your shooting at people who aren’t moving, or buildings that cant move, especially when its a small hit box on a mini sentry / teleporter, and especially when you randomly miss 2-3 shots in a row because of spread and then the engineer makes a clutch wrench swing against said building saving it and possibly making a big impact all because of RANDOMNESS.

    The Force Of Nature
    (?) no longer has increased knockback
    I understand that many scouts like to utilise the movement knockback of this unlock, but honestly, forced, unsurfable knockback doesnt belong in a fast pased movement shooter, and as such im removing the ability of this weapon to provide a movement based stun. Interestingly, this could be argued as both a buff and a nerf as now your damage with the 2nd round isn’t reduced due to increased distance between you and the target.

    The Shortstop
    (+) show the hidden weapon stats

    Secondaries!

    The Pretty Boys Pocket Pistol:
    (-) removed faster firing rate
    The current P.B.P.P is arguably a direct upgrade, as faster fire rate even without the health gain makes this a better pistol with the only downside being a slightly smaller clip, as such this is a nerf to hopefully keep it unique but also less of a direct upgrade
    is this enough of a nerf? Hard to say, but in the mean time without being able to actually test the weapon in game its enough of a nerf that im confident enough to put it down in this list of how I would balance the game, should it be not enough / to much of a nerf we can then talk about increasing/decreasing the health gained or clip size penalty.

    Crit-A-Cola
    (+) Instantly Recharges
    (+) no longer marks user for death when attacking
    (-) user can only use a melee weapon while under the effects of the drink
    The crit a cola must have some sort of crit gimmick hence the name, on top of that, scout is already extremely balanced already with just his stock weapons, as such it would be nigh impossible to balance the crit-a-cola while allowing the scout to use his scattergun. Any downsides related to making the scout less survivable such as marking him for death can easily be overcome with a small amount of teamwork such as medics uber (especially prevalent in competitive) as such I have nerfed this weapon so hard that it is no longer a real issue and now just a meme weapon for people who want to run around valve pubs mini-critting people with a fish.

    The Flying Guillotine
    (+) Crits whenever it would normally minicrit
    (-) no longer recharges faster when hitting players from long range
    (-) no longer mini crits at long range
    (-) no longer causes hit enemies to bleed
    The sandman guillotine combo was fairly fun combo that required skill to do, as such I have returned it to the game, should the power level of this combo be to strong or weak, then we can talk about buffing / nerfing it, instead of having it outright removed, it should be worth noting this would allow the flying guillotine to be combo’ed with the fan o’war, whilst I believe if a scout can get into melee range with someone the enemy is probably already in trouble, this is an area worth paying attention to.
    lastly the bleed change, the bleed lets the weapon deal a total of 190 damage enough to 1 shot anything except a soldier (who probably isn’t at full health due to rocket jumping) or a heavy but on the other hand it forces the weapon into being basically purely a combo weapon which im generally against as I believe weapons should be generally useful by themselves, and then made properly powerful via combo and load out choices

    The Mad Milk
    (+) reduced recharge time by 25% (15 seconds down from 20)
    (-) Milked targets no longer provide health to enemies when taking damage

    Melee’s!

    The Sandman
    (+) the ball now marks users for death
    (-) the ball no longer slows users
    (-) the sandman health reduction has been increased to -25

    The Sun on a Stick
    (+) added afterburn immunity while active
    (-) removed 25% fire damage reduction while active
    the sun on a stick has a weird use as an anti afterburn weapon since it reduces fire damage taken, since afterburn can be annoying for scouts with their low health pool, and their damage being very close range, but it does a poor job of this since its only 25%, this change makes it actually useful against afterburn and helping this weapon not be a complete joke

    The Soldier
    The soldier is in a really good place in my opinion, their is no game mode in the game that he doesn’t thrive in, and as such I’ve only really touched his “meme” weapons to make them more fun to use.

    Primaries!

    The Beggar’s Bazooka:
    (+) now correctly displays increased reload rate on the weapon stats
    I fail to see why hidden stats are even a thing, so I’m removing them on this weapon.
    NOTE: While I do not like R.N.G this weapon is balanced by R.N.G on its rocket trajectory, on top of that its slower firing rate leads me to believe even half decent soldiers could adjust their aim to counteract any form of predictability in the random spread as such the R.N.G will remain on this weapon.

    The Rocket Jumper
    (+) increases clip size by 1 per kill with secondary or melee weapon Limit of +6 for a total of a clip size of 10
    (+) Secondary fire now opens up a menu (like the disguise menu) allowing you to adjust the type of rocket you fire, including the original for central firing rockets, Airstrike for rapid fire, direct hit for fast rockets, beggars bazooka for overload jumping, and liberty launcher for… slightly faster rockets
    Note: when the weapon is adjusted to another type of rocket launcher the weapon model shifts into a jumper style of that weapon, shifting rocket style has a 2 second cool down and requires you to be on the ground.
    These 2 changes should be a nice buff to smart and skilled trolldiers especially those who can stay alive, it should also open up the trolldier play style to those who prefer rocket style of other rocket launchers such as the original, allowing more people to enjoy playing a trolldier play style.

    Secondaries!

    The Manntreads
    (+) immunity to fall damage (this does not come into affect if you land on an enemy)
    Fall damage is a bit of a pain for trolldiers, considering that the thermal thruster has both stomp damage, and fall damage reduction, this shouldn’t be an issue to program.

    Melee’s!

    The Disciplinary Action
    (?) Show the increased melee range and melee bounding box increase in the weapon stats

    The Pyro
    You would think that as a spy main I would hate pyro and nerf him to the ground, but the truth is I don’t hate him, and instead sympathize a fair bit with those that choose to main him, the first question being what is his class role, is he a flanker? or a support? my answer? Why not both, as such I’ve given him support buffs and flanking buffs, second question, why haven’t I touched his airblast hitbox or push mechanics or flamethrowers particle size/velocity, or made his flamethrower hitscan answer: because without extensive testing of changes to something as fundamental as his flame thrower, I wouldn’t be able to say what is fair and balanced, if I could test massive changes to the pyros flame thrower in a test client then I would love to see how certain changes would play out, the biggest one that comes to mind is making it a hitscan weapon.

    Primaries!

    All Flamethrowers
    (+) Air blast now removes the jarate, mad milk, water droplets, gas passer debuffs on team mates
    This is to give the pyro even more support that is focused on counteracting the enemies over directly buffing team mates.
    (+) reduced damage taken by your own reflected projectiles by 50%
    This is to promote reflecting projectiles in cases where it would hurt the Pyro, and also promote reflect jumping Pyros, which is a skillful, and impressive thing to do, which is honestly under valued, I mean Pyros lose more than half their health for some reflect jumps, leaving it as a basically suicidal play even at the highest levels of highlander, which is honestly such a shame.
    (-) increased flame particle transparency (specifically to the old flame textures)
    Whilst the tf2 developers have gone on record saying they purposefully made flamethrowers “visually noisy” I personally believe this is an un-necessary and down right annoying way to buff an easy to play playstyle (notably W+M1) it should also be worth noting that when the tf2 devs talked about the flame particles being visually noisy with the OLD flame particles, which were more transparent than the current ones.
    (-) Airblasting players now does a visual check to make sure that the player is within 37 degrees of the player
    so the old air blast (before jungle inferno) used to actually check if the player being air blasted was within 37 degrees of the direction the Pyro was facing, this was to stop people from being airblasted from behind (an issue the current airblast has) as well as create a bit of a “cone” for the airblast hitboxes
    this check was removed in jungle inferno for unknown reasons
    lastly (and surprisingly/disapointingly) the current airblast hitboxes are actually a 256x256x256 cube, not the cone that was promised on the jungle inferno patch notes
    (?) All Fire damage now causes a special death animation as the body burns to a crisp
    (thanks tf2classic)

    The Phlogistinator
    (-) no longer gain immunity to damage when activating Mmmph
    Whilst the phlogisinator isn’t exactly strong, it is definitely on the cheap side, as such I’ve made it so you can’t just activate mmpph wherever you want and instead require you to actually be a bit sneaky with it, this should also nerf medics pocketing phlog Pyro’s, as even with a medic healing the Pyro, being unable to act for a few seconds while you activate mmph is likely to get you killed unless the medic wants to use some of their uber charge.

    The Dragon’s Fury
    (+) Removed re-pressurization penalty from airblasting
    (+) Moved the Dragons Fury Hit boxes forward slightly
    (+) Fix the bug that causes the projectile to no longer do damage once colliding with certain projectiles
    (?) Fix the Lag caused by the Dragons fury (its my understanding this is caused by sudden lighting shifts, but im not a programmer)
    The Dragons Fury is already worse than the stock flamethrower because of its significantly harder aim requirements, adding on an airblast penalty just makes this potentially fun side grade shit (and honestly if it does make pyro stronger and it becomes the meta, its not like people are going to complain about a reduction of Pyro W+M1-ing)
    lastly moving the hitboxes forward means you could reach a bit further, at the cost of not being able to hit people behind you

    Secondaries!

    The Thermal Thruster:
    (+) increased max charges to 3 (up from 2)
    (+) increased recharge rate by 33% (10 seconds per charge down from 15 seconds)
    (+) increased switch from speed by 50%
    (+) Picking up Metal now recharges the Thermal Thruster (large ammo pack for 1 charge)
    (?) now correctly shows the 30% reduced knockback and reduced falling damage while thrusting on the weapons stats
    I love alternate play styles in tf2, its a shame that this one is so terribly weak, as such I’ve given it a bunch of buffs to speed it up, I doubt any of these will be any real issue, as ultimately the Pyro will always be extremely range limited without a damaging secondary to back him up, but i am more than happy to reign it back in should it turn out to be one.

    The Detonator
    (+) Removed +50% damage to self
    NOTE: this would not change the capabilities of detonator jumping
    Detonator jumping is a fun and cool thing to do, it also takes a fair bit of practice, I see little reason why you need to take extra damage.

    The Scorch Shot
    (-) no longer has increased knockback
    (-) now detonates on first hit as opposed to bouncing reducing the amount of damage a single scorch shot can do, and making it more comparable to the detonator
    I dislike movement stuns in this movement based shooter as such im removing the ability of this weapon to provide a movement based stun, as for the double hit mechanic, this is to make the scorch shot be more inline with other flare guns

    Melee’s!
    Someone once told me that all of Pyros weapons besides the Powerjack are useless, and whilst I disagree, I made most of these changes to basically flex on that person. With that being said I doubt many of these would be as good as the Powerjack, but I can still see these being situationally used,

    The Pain Train:
    (+) can now be used as a melee weapon by Pyros
    This is a nice melee weapon that promotes flanking Pyros to try and ninja / back cap, it also allows support focused Pyros to cap faster while more important classes push forward, or hold a more defensive location.

    Postal Pummler
    Note: No longer shares Stats with The Axtinguisher
    (+) Speed Boost Granted on non Axtinguish Kills
    the current Axtinguisher isn’t an issue by any means, and I think its fine to leave in the game, in the idea of not alienating players who genuinely enjoy a weapon that has no issues, and also to offer more options to players who enjoy the type of playstyle I’ve decided to keep both versions of the weapon available for players to use.

  • Pt 2

    The Axtinguisher
    (+) Removed damage penalty
    (+) Melee attacks from behind now full crit (uses backstab “hitboxes”)
    (+) Removed melee delay when attacking from behind
    (+) Melee attacking team mates extinguishes them
    (-) Removed damage based on afterburn duration
    (-) -90% damage against non burning players
    (-) Removed Speed Boost on Axtinguish Kills
    the current Axtinguisher is “okay” but far from great, its good enough that it gives a bit of a dopamine hit for pulling off some fancy frag movie quality kills, but its not particularly great, this rework makes it a lot more similar to the Pre-Tough Break Axtinguisher, but fixes one of the biggest issues the Pre-Tough Break Axtinguisher had (that being quickly 2 shotting heavies) this could have easily been fixed by making the Axtinguisher actually extinguish the enemy instead of just dealing a bunch of damage, this means that previously a Pyro had to puff, switch to melee, melee attack twice for a kill, this was especially easy with the old degreaser, with the Axtinugisher I’m suggesting it would take, puff, switch to Axtingusiher, melee attack, slowly switch to flamethrower, puff, switch back to Axtinguisher, and attack again, which gives the heavy / overhealed soldier significantly more time to react against the axtinguisher, on the flip side, the Pyro could puff, flare, then melee, but this adds significantly more time for the heavy / overhealed soldier to react, adding a nice risk reward situation, and requiring some aim from the pyro. The Axtinguisher also feels a little clunky in its current design, with damage being based on afterburn remaining, meaning that it can be hard to tell how much damage you will actually do with the weapon this stat was removed, this also means that Pyros cant just (somewhat cheapily) puff, and sting since that would only deal 88 damage, and instead need to flank properly, trickstab the enemy or disorientate the enemy with an airblast (such as airblasting them up, and attacking from below.)

    Homewrecker:
    (+) +50% sentry damage resistance while active
    (-) no longer able to remove sappers
    A “pybro” engineer combo can be an incredibly difficult combo for the enemy to take down, and this is without the homewrecker or neon annihilator being able to remove sappers. The ability to reflect spam, push spies, ubered medics and their pockets away, and keep spies away via flaming around and tracking down invisible spies is already incredibly powerful. The ability to also remove sappers allows a Pyro to “make up” for his own mistakes should the spy manage to actually get a stab and sap on the sentry. This is ultimately to forgiving to the Pyro, it also punishes and nerfs the spy who quite possibly lost his life (especially in competitive) just to stab the engineer and sap his sentry all because of a single item in the Pyros melee slot, that has little downsides to using it, as the only other melee weapon that is competitively viable is the Powerjack, and when you are on defense, you don’t need to move around as much as you are far less likely to be extending into the enemy team, and more likely be playing with your team, of which you are going to be stationed with the engineer who is quite immobile, or with the core, which will usually have the heavy or demoman both of which are slower than you, your also more likely not going to need to roll out as far, as you’re more likely to have a teleporter set up, or not need to run far from your spawn point, you also don’t need to roll out as often due to longer respawn times, and the fact that you generally die less on defense. worst case scenario if rolling out takes 20 seconds which is usually NOT the case then, then you save less than 3 seconds, when it comes to falling back, you usually want to be the last to fall back, to help airblast projectiles, or worst case scenario, act as a “meat” shield as you are the 2nd least important class in the game. and the last use for the Powerjack is in combat to chase down a player letting you flame thrower them, but once more, if your playing as a Pybro, your goal is to play more defensively, not chase players down, and on top of that, you have a secondary, and a sentry to back you up.
    As for adding the sentry damage resistance, Pyro is one of the classes that is hard countered by engineer’s with little difficulty on the engineers part, and little counter play on the Pyros, and as such giving the Pyro some options to counter engineers, this is meant as a nice little utility, and not something to actually allow Pyros to reliably counter engineers, the ability to run up and 1 hit a mini while taking half damage sort of thing, not running into an engi nest and wrecking havoc, without being able to test in game how strong 50% damage reduction on sentries is, as well as common sentry spots, the numbers here might need to be fiddled with, or other stats might need to be added on (such as knockback resistance like the manntreads have) but for now, 50% damage resistance is fine in my eyes.

    The Neon Annihilator
    (+) can crit players hit by the Gas Passer
    (-) no longer able to remove sappers
    For removing the ability to un-sap buildings I repeat what I had said above, on the other hand I’ve also allowed it to crit with the gas passer because, why not? gasoline is a liquid? I fear valve is scared of adding a “cheap combo” to the game, like they have with the jarate bushwacka, but they fail to realise that Pyro is already really strong at close range, whilst sniper is a lot weaker close range, the jarate is also a lot more spamable than the gas passer, and the Neon Annihlator does less damage than the bushwacka so I genuinely doubt this could be an issue.

    The Hot Hand
    (+) +70% melee range
    (+) +55% melee bounding box increase
    (+) attacking team mates grants you a speed boost
    (+) attacking team mates grants them a speed boost
    (?) mention that the weapon has a weird double attack mechanic
    this is basically the same as the whip for soldier
    on the topic of support pyro, I have had the idea, of “what if pyro had the whip” and I reckon it would be a good idea, I could see this actually being used in highlander/prolander, and it frees up your soldier to focus more on the flank instead of having to awkwardly rush your heavy to mid, instead of defending the flank, or preparing the bomb on 5cp maps and koth maps

    The Back Scratcher
    (+) on kill: heal for 50% of max health (able to overheal up to 150% of max health)
    (?) the back scratcher will now appear on the pyros back when not being wielded
    The back scratcher is useful for pyros flanking the enemy as it provides extra health from health packs, I’ve tried to improve upon this by also making it a great combo pyro weapon, granting health for getting melee kills with it, I do worry a little about it being really strong in medieval mode, but considering that demoknights get the half zatoichi that also heals for more, and also have a shield that grants crits, im not too worried, it is worth paying attention to however. lastly, I have made it visible at all times as counting damage numbers on enemies is an important ability, and should a pyro manage to gain a health pack in the middle of a fight it can throw off how much health you thought the pyro received.

    The Demoman
    The Demoman is in a really good spot, being one of the 6s classes, and being very powerful in casual, highlander, MvM, 6s, and any other game mode he is in, he also happens to be my 3rd least played class, so the changes here are all pretty minor, and focus mostly around his weaker weapons / alternative play styles, as I don’t want to make uneducated changes on the class.

    Primaries!

    ALL Grenade Launchers
    (+) removed random spread
    as i have said mulltiple times I am not a fan of RNG in this game, if i shoot my weapon i want to hit or miss because of my own capabilities, not because of RNG, of note the RNG on the Grenade launchers is very small, so its not super noticeable, but regardless I am removing it
    Note: server owners can decide in their own server settings whether or not Grenade Launchers have random spread (like how they can decide on shotgun bloom)

    The Loose Cannon
    (-) Knockback may now be surfed by enemies
    I dislike movement stuns in this movement based shooter as such im removing the ability of this weapon to provide a movement based stun. now my first thought was to remove this from the weapon, but the knockback is essential to the double donk mechanic so instead I changed it to allow you to surf the projectile like any other, bad players and those caught by surprise will still get double donked with relative ease, but more advanced players can now skillfully surf themselves away.

    The Ali Baba’s Wee Booties
    (+) Increased Movement speed while equiped with a shield by 15% (up from 10%) (322 hammer units per second up from 308)
    Demoknight is a fun loadout, but its shunted by its reliance on melee range, the Ali Baba’s Wee Booties help this a little bit, by increasing your movement speed from 280 hmu/s to 308 hmu/s but I would like to see this increased even more to help demoknight (especially non eyelander demoknights) not be countered so hard by enemies walking away from you

    Secondaries!

    ALL sticky bomb launchers
    (+) removed random spread
    as i have said multiple times I am not a fan of RNG in this game, if i shoot my weapon i want to hit or miss because of my own capabilities, not because of RNG, of note the RNG on the Sticky bomb launchers is very small, so its not super noticeable, but regardless I am removing it
    Note: server owners can decide in their own server settings whether or not Sticky Bomb Launchers have random spread (like how they can decide on shotgun bloom)

    Melee’s!

    The Eyelander
    (-) Reduced the amount of speed gained per head by 4 hmu per second per head
    (-) switching weapons via a resupply closet removes all your heads
    The speed reduction nerf is only slight, and is to offset the speed buff the Ali Baba’s Wee Booties now have
    For those that did not know, you can play demoknight or hybrid knight collect 4 heads, and switch to the sticky bomb launcher, this results in a Demoman with more health than a soldier, who runs almost as fast as a scout, and with a longer melee range with the only downsides being no random crits on their melee and a slower switch speed to their sword, now whilst this is a fairly rare occurrence, when it does happen with a skilled Demoman player, it feels borderline unfair, especially if they have a medic healing them.

    The Ullapool Caber
    (+) deals crits while the user is explosive jumping
    (+) damage with the caber reduces recharge time (300 damage to fully recharge)
    (+) now recharges over time, 1 second recharging 5 damage, this means that the ullapool caber will take at most 60 seconds
    (+) fix the ullapool cabers inconsistent damage (fixed in Team Comtress 2)
    The Ullapool caber is in a strange spot, ultimately it wouldn’t be balanced if it could 1 shot a light class as demomans primary weakness is scouts, this is why the explosive damage AT MOST is 124 damage, regardless I have given it a buff to turn it into a sort of market gardener, I have also allowed it to recharge over time and from damage it deals, I should remind you that a crit caber does more than 300 damage, this means it will instantly recharge.

    The Claidheamh Mòr
    (+) +25 hp on kill
    This is a nice small buff to help counteract the vulnerability the claidheamh mor currently has, as right now it is the “squishiest” demoknight sword.

    The Heavy
    The heavy has a lot of issues, but most of them stem from the fact that people just find him boring to play, and cheap to play against, as such his been nerfed time and time again almost every update to be less cheap to fight against, as I am not a heavy main, nor have I spent a ton of hours on heavy, I do not feel confident giving heavy anything especially new.

    Primaries!

    ALL miniguns
    (+) no longer does reduced damage to sentries
    I’m willing to bet many of you don’t even know this exists, with that being said the heavy is already the worst power class against sentries because of his lack of splash damage and his bullet spread, I don’t think he needs to be un-necessarily worse (also its just helps speed up the game).
    (+) Snipers are no longer granted flinch immmunity from the mini gun while scopped in at over 750 hammer units away
    for those that are unaware, miniguns will not cause flinching on a scoped in sniper over 750 hammer units away
    this (to me atleast) seems like a needless nerf to heavy, and a needless buff for sniper

    The Natascha
    (+) grants a speed boost to the heavy on hit
    (+) removed slower rev speed
    (-) no longer slows enemies hit
    (-) removed damage resistance when below half health
    Yes this is stolen from higps’s balance mod.
    No I don’t like higps or his balance mod, but even a broken clock is right twice a day.
    As for the actual changes, having a minigun that helps the heavy dodge enemy projectiles (for defensive purposes) or chase enemies around corners (for offensive purposes) is an interesting idea in my opinion, on the victims side, I do not like movement restrictions in tf2 as it is a movement shooter, where movement is rewarded, and as such reworking the natascha is a good idea in my mind, how good this particular rework is is up for debate, but I would at the minimum like to see it tried out, worst case scenario its still better than being slowed to a crawl as a victim

    New primary (mini gun) slot weapon
    The Budget Potato
    (+) Consumable heals for 400 health
    (+) recharge time of 10 seconds
    (+) can be thrown as a medium health pack
    This is literally identical to the sandvich, except it regenerates faster and is a replacement for the mini gun, this is primarily for fat scouts so their mini-gun slot isn’t useless, but can also be for friendlies who just love throwing food at people, as well as melee heavies in medieval mode, turning them even more into a typical “paladin” able to heal fairly decently with 2 different lunchbox items and also be fairly tanky at the downside of low mobility and damage. Lastly people just love potatoes, potatoes are quite memeable, potatoes are used to make vodka, a lot of gamers identify with being a couch potato, etc etc

    Melee’s!

    The Gloves of Running Urgently
    (+) no longer drains health while active
    (-) Marks user for death while active
    a wee bit controversial, but I am of the opinion that competitive mode should have some weapons banned, the Pre-Jungle Inferno GRU being a prime example of this, the G.R.U was never an issue in ANY part of the game, except in 6s, (though it is rightfully an issue in 6s) as such id much rather the weapon just be banned in 6s, instead of ruining it for many many players who never even touched, and might never touch the ruleset.

    The Eviction Notice
    Notes: this is a complete reversion to the Pre-Jungle Inferno gloves of running urgently.
    (+) increased faster movement speed by 30%
    (+) removed damage penalty
    (-) increased maximum health drain rate while equipped (to be identical to the current G.R.U)
    (-) removed faster attack speed
    (-) removed speed boost on hit
    the eviction notice has had a strange and frankly sad life time, starting off as a weird melee that let you get a speed boost on hit, for a significant damage penalty, it soon became a mini G.R.U being less punishing, but with less of a movement increase, the weapon ended up always being in the shadow of its bigger brother as people would almost always choose to go all the way when choosing between a slow melee and the GRU, as such it was relegated to a meme “jojo” weapon simply for its attack speed, but not even a popular meme,
    honestly the current GRU is fine to leave in the game, as its only issues are related to the bugs that cause infinite health heavies, in the idea of not alienating players who genuinely enjoy a weapon that has no issues, and also to offer more options to players who enjoy the type of playstyle I’ve decided to keep both versions of the weapon available for players to use, by just axing the weapon entirely, and replace it with the current version of the Gru.

    The Holiday Punch
    (+) removed melee attack delay when attacking from behind
    (+) now uses backstab “hit boxes”
    heavy trickstab compilation when?
    jokes aside this is just to make the holiday punchs “backstab mechanics” a bit more consistent with actual backstab mechanics

    The Engineer
    I’m sure a lot of you have noticed that the engineer gets nerfed a fair bit with these changes, its not that I hate engineer, its more just a few factors combining.

    1. I don’t play engineer enough to make an informed suggestion about how to buff him.
    2. Engineers by far slow down the game the most of any class, and slow choke point pushing games aren’t fun for most players.
    3. Most of his weapons are fairly balanced as they are, and so I cant really buff him without making a new weapon.
    4. I don’t want to make anything that is drastically new without being able to test how it would actually play in a developer test client.
      regardless my goal is to try and make engineers less of an immobile defensive wall and more of a building based support character, as well as promoting more mobile, and aggressive gameplay, that ultimately creates better risk reward situations for engineers, as such I have given the engineer some buffs that hopefully help with this goal. If i had the option to play test things, i would like to see how “Speed Pads” could work as a replacement to teleporters, i would like to see how a “Mini Dispencer” or “Dispenser Backpack” would work over the regular dispenser.

    Buildings!

    ALL buildings
    (+) hauling a building no longer slows the engineer down
    some of the smartest plays engineers can make is knowing when to move a building forward or back from the front line, especially when they make risky plays moving a level 3 sentry behind the front lines to provide a strong flanking position against the enemy, its these kinds of plays I would like to see more of, and as such part of my goal to speed engineers up and make them less of a slow and boring turtle is accomplished here by not punishing engineers for trying to move gear around the map

    Sentry Guns:
    (-) Mini gun damage resistance reduced to 0
    I’m willing to bet many of you don’t even know this exists, with that being said the heavy is already the worst power class against sentries because of his lack of splash damage and his bullet spread (especially from outside a sentries range), I don’t think the heavy needs to be un-necessarily worse against sentries (also this change just helps speed up the game which im generally in favour for).

    Primaries!

    The Rescue Ranger
    (-) shooting a disguised spy will now make the same sound as shooting a team mate
    (-) primary fire no longer pierces through team mates
    I’m willing to bet many of you didn’t even know of this mechanic, regardless this is to stop engineers from being able to spy check players from a distance and instead need to either make a judgement based on the spies ability to act, or attempt to kill the potential spy, this ultimately is a buff to spies disguise believability.

    Secondaries!

    The Short Circuit
    (-) Primary Fire replaced with current Alt fire (the current primary fire aka the “taser” is removed)
    (-) Reduced Energy Balls Damage by 100%
    (-) Reduced Energy Ball Size by 33%
    (+) secondary fire now teleports your buildings to you at the cost of 100 metal (identical to the rescue ranger)
    The short circuits taser has an auto aim feature that allows the engineer to skill-lessly check for cloaked spies which is honestly a needless nerf to spy, its large projectile also allows for very easy checking for spies, as (especially down a choke point) it is nigh impossible to dodge.
    The short circuits taser (all though weak) does let it somewhat steal the pistols job of finishing off damaged opponents, as does the damage component of the energy orb.
    The nerf here is less of a nerf to the short circuit and more of a buff to the pistol, as well as the spy.
    lastly the energy ball projectile size is just way to big, and as such takes little skill to use effectively against projectile classes, as such reducing the ball size by 33% should still leave it as fairly big but not outlandishly so, requirely more skill on the engineers part to properly counter soldiers and demomen.
    As for the teleporting buildings to you, this should give the engineer some of the fun of the rescue ranger to aggressively relocate your buildings into the enemies territory, all without coming at the cost of being stuck with a “potato” gun that does a measly 40 damage on a projectile, and it leaves the rescue ranger as the meta weapon for healing and rescuing your buildings on defense, whilst still giving the engineer to be more aggressive on offense.
    and whilst sacrificing a shotgun is a lot more impactful than sacrificing a pistol, it also means you’re sacrificing the healing component of the rescue ranger, requiring you to hit your buildings with a wrench to heal them

    The Pistol
    (+) Reduced reload time from 1.36 seconds to 1.25 seconds
    Once again im willing to bet many people didn’t know this, but the engineer actually reloads his pistol slower than the scouts, so I have reduced his reload time to be identical to the scouts.
    This is to help promote the pistol’s usage over the other secondaries, it also promotes using the pistol to spy check, and engineers using their brains, and lastly with engineer becoming a slower beefier scout in highlander that occasionally builds some buildings (aka battle engineer) giving the engineer a bit more sustain damage should help him square off against the other 2 classes commonly seen on the flank (that being the scout and soldier, both much more powerful classes).

    The Wrangler
    (+) -100% damage to self (can still be propelled by bullets and explosives shot by the sentry)
    (-) no longer shields the sentry while weapon is active (still provides a red “bubble” to indicate its being wrangled)
    This weapon is a staple of payload defense engineer, but it is also notoriously strong giving sentries over 600 (effective) health (on top of buildings being immune to crits) making a good nesting engineer a ridiculous wall to overcome in both casual and highlander, both casual and highlander both have slow pacing and as such I have decided to nerf to this weapon, I have thought about giving the wrangler a smaller shield but for now I think no shield is fine. Lastly I should remind people, the wrangler still gives the sentry 3 strengths even without any damage reduction at all.
    Firstly, it doubles the fire rate of the sentry.
    Secondly, it also removes the range limitations of the sentry at the cost of only losing the pistol.
    Thirdly, it allows you to choose the target for your sentry gun letting you focus fire medics or shoot disguised spies.

    The Medic
    The medic has a few issues, but for the most part is fairly fine, his abilities in the game also are so key to competitive tf2 being as fun as it is, that’s not to say that he some of his weapons don’t need nerfs cough crossbow cough but I don’t feel confident in talking about how those changes should occur, as I’m not an expert medic player by any means as such I’ve barely touched the medic, and mostly only touched the parts of medic that interact with spy.

    Primaries

    ALL Syringe Guns (except the crossbow)
    (+) Removed Random Spread
    the travel time of the syringe guns already makes them a terrible weapon for anything other than spraying it while back peddeling, the random spread just ends up being a needless downside on an already weak weapon
    Note: server owners can decide in their own server settings whether or not Syringe Guns have random spread (like how they can decide on shotgun bloom)

    Secondaries!

    All Mediguns
    (?) healing a spy disguised as scout will increase your run speed to scout levels irregardless of the team of the spy
    This is a buff to spies disguise believability, worth noting that this is also occasionally a buff to medics helping them occasionally role out faster if their is no teleporters to use (or the teleporters safeness is unknown), and their is no scout to heal whilst rolling out, this also allows a medic to use a friendly spy to help retreat should the medic need to fall back.
    originally I was going to remove the medics run speed boost when healing scouts, but its my understanding that giving medics that speed boost helps speed up 6s matches and helps counteract stalematey play.

    ALL Mediguns (except stock)
    (?) now correctly shows stats (show that ubering doesn’t make you invulnerable)
    very small change, but id argue its important for new players, as I’ve seen a few new players not understand that the kritzkreig isn’t a direct upgrade to the stock medigun.

    New Medigun
    (+) guarantees critical hits for the medic when popping uber
    (+) uber charge gained from damaging enemies (and healing team mates)
    (+) uber affects the medic even when the medic holds his melee or primary weapons
    (+) healing players also heals you
    (-) uber charge does not affect the medics target
    (-) can not over heal
    I love alternative playstyles and as such wanted a battle medic medigun, my biggest worry about this medigun is people using it in comp for “dry pushes” if that ends up being an issue, then im more than happy to reduce or remove the self healing mechanic, but due to the lack of over heal I find this unlikely to be issue, the ability to “surprise” people with crits could also be an issue, but should this truly be an issue making the medic need to taunt in order to activate their crits (similar to the phlog) could be a solution. Lastly I’ve left the the damage to full charge number intentionally absent as finding a balanced number would require testing in game, and not something that can be theorised.
    lastly, it could be annoying to have a medic on your team that cant uber properly, my thoughts on this is that it would increase the amount of medics on teams overall, and having a medic that cant uber is better than having a class that cant heal at all

    Melee’s!

    The Ubersaw
    (-) now displays an Organ on the ubersaw after a successfully gaining uber from attacking an enemy player
    Note: the organ should be fairly big and obvious, almost cartoonishly big, but not so big that it makes things difficult to see
    This is a nice little visual affect that also allows people to realise if a medic has successfully gotten a saw on an enemy.

    The Vitasaw
    (-) now displays an Organ on the vitasaw after a successfully stealing an organ from an enemy player
    Note: the organ should be fairly big and obvious, almost cartoonishly big, but not so big that it makes things difficult to see
    This is a nice little visual affect that also allows people to realise if a medic has successfully gotten a saw on an enemy.

    The Sniper
    The sniper is in a fairly controversial spot in the game right now, many people believe that he is to powerful, or that just because something takes skill to do doesn’t mean that its balanced, or that his lack of counter play is a massive issue, and whilst I don’t fully agree, with everything, I definitely understand, and as such I’ve mostly nerfed sniper in ways that doesn’t directly make him weaker, but instead adds back some counter play he so sorely lacks.

    Primaries!

    ALL sniper rifles (except the huntsman)
    (-) Shots fired shoot a Tracer round
    this change would have little effect on sniper competitively but will make snipers sightlines in casual easier to avoid, and should help counter the lack of communication you see in casual
    (-) no longer grant flinch immmunity from the mini gun while scopped in at over 750 hammer units away
    for those that are unaware, miniguns will not cause flinching on a scoped in sniper over 750 hammer units away
    this (to me atleast) seems like a needless nerf to heavy, and a needless buff for sniper

    Secondaries!

    The Jarate
    (-) no longer reveals cloaked spies
    (-) -30% explosion radius
    (-) -50% effect duration
    (-) starts at 0% charge, cant be refilled by resupply, charged by damage, 500 damage for full charge
    (-) removed shorter regeneration time from extinguishing team mates (stat no longer works with new design)
    1st it extinguishes after burn on himself and others
    this use is completely fine
    2nd it allows a sniper and his team mates to track down spies really easily
    I don’t believe this should be an ability that sniper has, the sniper does not have enough class counters, all whilst countering pretty much every other class, spy is arguably the closest thing he has to a class counter, and yet the sniper has a lot of options against spies, as such I’ve removed the ability for it to reveal cloaked spies
    3rd comboing it with the bushwacka
    this gives sniper an almost brainless 2 weapon combo that makes sniper at close range a fairly considerable threat, as such Ive made the jarate no longer refilled by resupply cabinets, and require damage to charge
    4th throwing it onto a team fight for basically free minicrits on the enemy team (especially prevalent in competitive)
    this gives snipers a serious impact on a team fight without requiring any significant skill, and whilst only sacrificing other secondary weapons, of which, none are a big loss
    5th its arguably a better self defense tool than the SMG (even without the bushwacka) and its biggest (only) downside is that you dont have the smg (or other backpack items) if you are using it, since throwing it means you only need 2 body shots with the sniper rifle, or 1 melee and 1 body shot, as opposed to 3 body shots, or 1 melee and 2 body shots, on light classes, against demomen medics soldiers (that aren’t at 200 health) and pyros it means the sniper only needs 3 body shots instead of 4 (medic health regen) or 2 melee’s instead of 3, no matter what class you are playing, it basically gives sniper 1 free body shot against you in less time than it takes for the smg to shoot you for the same amount of damage (unless the sniper goes for a risky quickscope)
    all these nerfs combined should leave the jarate as a situational self defense tool (especially since im not touching the bushwacka) but overall a lot more fair to play against, and a lot less cheap to use, that can also situationally help in team fights
    lastly 500 damage is just a rough value, as I can’t actually test with a dev client what exactly would be considered fair and balanced, but having to headshot 3 people, and throw in a body shot too seems fairly balanced to me, but ingame it could be hard to say.

    The Razorback
    (-) +25% bullet vulnerability
    Whilst the razorback might be “balanced”, that doesn’t change the fact that the razorback is a VERY poorly designed weapon, removing class counters from an already dominant class at the expense of an overall weaker class which derives much of its value from high value picks, all through a passive equip. as such I have made it a non issue with the bullet vulnerability (so that you can 1 shot with the ambassador, or 2 shot with any revolver (except the letranger and (new) enforcer)

    Removed:
    Random crits
    Whilst I understand that random crits can be occasionally funny, the truth is 99 times out of 100 they are just infuriating

    Alot of these may not be viable, but I am just looking to spark a conversation here. What would you change about these weapons?

  • shut up and take my reddit gold

  • agree with all, upvoting

  • Rgl balance mod when?

  • dont care + didnt read + ratio + L + you fell off + mid af + tf2 sucks + play overwatch + double ratio

  • Only things I outright disagree with are the razorback nerf and the ambi buff.

    The razorback’s whole purpose is to counter spies while being weaker to every other class. If the sniper can still get one shot by the ambi, then its use is completely pointless. This is especially bad combined with your buff to the ambi, which would mean the spy could one-shot the sniper from anywhere on the map. On top of this, it’s already a terrible item to use in comp.

    I think the ambi should probably be buffed but it should be somewhere in between its original height and where it is now. Old ambi was insane against decent players. The class that should be good for extremely close quarters getting only 50 damage less on hs than sniper at all ranges was not balanced. At its longest range, the damage should be buffed, but there should still be a fairly large damage fall off over distance.

    Also, could you further explain the “(+) -100% damage to self (can still be propelled by bullets and explosives shot by the sentry)” on the wrangler?

    EDIT: After further thought, a lot of this is terrible lol

  • agree with all, upvoting

  • @TheS4rr said in Potential Balance changes discussion Doc:

    Only things I outright disagree with are the razorback nerf and the ambi buff.

    Engie Can no longer hurt himself with the wrangler, this can be used for more things such as jumps, sick wrangler play, and overall makes the engineer more dynamic and unpredictable.

  • good shit

  • hydrate.

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