Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media

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  • Reminder that there is a difference from Free Speech and Consequence Free Speech.

    Free speech means the government cant do anything about your saying slurs.

    That does not mean that there are not political, social, or cultural repercussions to your actions.

  • there should literally be no argument about free speech here. you do not have a human right to participate in a TF2 league. being barred from the league does not “silence your free speech” it just means you have to go elsewhere to voice it. Jesus Christ

  • @Mothership That is true. The “government” in this situation would be RGL.

  • if you say some stupid shit that a group of people don’t like they are under no obligation to associate with you or give you a platform for said stupid shit

  • @Papaya contrary to popular belief RGL is not a totalitarian Orwellian 1984 police state government. it’s a tf2 league

  • @Xenagos The argument about it applying to public speech is separate. This forum is specifically discussing its application to PRIVATE discord servers. As for discord servers being private, in the context of RGL they are. RGL does not own discord, erego they are private in this situation.

  • @Papaya Incorrect. The Government is literally the US Government. RGL as a private entitiy can determine on their own how they police their own platform as long as those actions are not based on sex, religion, etc that are protected from the constitution. Free speech does not apply to RGL nor will any political entity be able to do anything about it.

  • @cyclowns The league is owned and operated by the organization RGL, and in my opinion they should uphold the rights of players to have free speech in private. Whether they are an actual government or not has no bearing on this situation.

  • these are all different interpretations for what free speech means, its all subjective and up to opinion. Of course I am of the opinion that free speech should be almost limitless.

    I mean, how hard is it to just block someone or turn off your monitor if you don’t like what someone is saying? Just look the other way lmao. It takes more effort to silence someone than just ignoring them.

    Stop letting words have this power over you; grow thicker skin.

  • @Papaya And where exactly does this right to free speech come from?

    @Kastaling how hard is it to just not say slurs

  • @Mothership As per my many, many previous posts, the “free speech” being referenced here is an abstract moral concept, not a law. Whether or not RGL is legally obligated to uphold free speech on their platform has no bearing on whether or not they are morally obligated to.

  • @Xenagos i dont like what you are saying, please stop posting. how hard is it to just not post what you are posting?

  • heres a scenario. a guy walks up to you and screams, once an hour every single hour of the day. you tell him to fuck off. did you violate his freedom of speech?

  • @Xenagos The right to free speech is an abstract concept, it does not “come” from anywhere, but is instead something that can either be quashed or upheld, similar to the right to life. A government could kill all of its citizens, or it could not. An organization can uphold free speech or it could not.

  • @cyclowns Again, this situation is different because you are facing consequences from your peers, not from the entity in charge. What if the government arrested you for screaming? That is a violation of free speech.

  • Hit submit too soon, sorry.

    “haver thicker skin” is an excuse bigots use to keep saying hurtful shit. It also in this context means “stop letting hurtful things hurt you” which no. I’m not gonna be quiet about hurtful things because again, people are saying those things to be hurtful.

    I think policing private discords would be a fucking incredibly difficult task from the RGL side of things, but I also think it’s silly to say that people using bigoted language is good, fine, and not a reflection how they see others.

  • @Papaya let me remind you that RGL is not the government. RGL is not a faceless entity that lives above you and controls your life. it’s a group of people that own and moderate a tf2 league. in what sense is this scenario not equivalent?

  • @cyclowns Because RGL as an organization is in charge of the league RGL. That is like saying “the government is just a bunch of individuals who run a country, so they don’t have to uphold your rights” When it comes to bans or unbans, RGL DOES in fact control whether you can play in RGL or not, so in this instance specifically RGL is analogous to a government entity.

  • @Papaya said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

    @cyclowns Again, this situation is different because you are facing consequences from your peers, not from the entity in charge. What if the government arrested you for screaming? That is a violation of free speech.

    Okay, so someone makes a PUG group, and says if you say slurs you’re banned. They’re the entity in charge, is that restricting your free speech?

  • @Xenagos In the context of the PUG group, yes. In the context of RGL, no.

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