RGL PUG Admins

@Xenagos it has badlands spire it is automatically wrong

Essentially title, if you were to make the perfect 5cp map, what points would you take from what maps? Any 5cp map counts, not just those currently in rotation/have been played competitively (but the point is to make a map for competitive 6s)

idea shamelessly stolen from @Xenagos

@Alto I think it’s more of a thought experiment in which points are good than in which points would go well combined

Upward 1st > Vigil 1st > Borneo 1st > Swiftwater 1st > Barnblitz 1st

Upward is pretty much the gold standard of first points, a point which can be exchanged on but isn’t a super strong hold either once ubers are out. Other maps (Vigil, Borneo, Swift) essentially have throwaway firsts, though you will see the exchange sometimes on borneo 1st, and others (Barnblitz) force the cart through a tight choke that can be painful to dislodge

Vigil 2nd > Swiftwater 2nd > Upward 2nd > Borneo 2nd > Barnblitz 2nd

Vigil is great because there are options and based on what picks you have there are multiple viable pushes (hill, side tunnel, 9 man main tunnel). Swiftwater has options too, but RED has a massive height advantage for 2 of 3 viable pushes so it’s not as good. Upward doesn’t have options but it’s saved from being a brick wall by the fact that it’s actually not that hard to push. Borneo and Barnblitz 2nd, well, suck. All points are holdable; Vigil, Swiftwater, and Upward are the most balanced here in that order.

Upward 3rd > Vigil 3rd > Swiftwater 3rd > Barnblitz 3rd > Borneo 3rd

Upward 3rd, once again, has options. It has good spam angles, good sightlines, and flanks that put you in the heart of the RED team, but is also very holdable for a team that knows what they’re doing. Vigil 3rd also has options but the hill for the cart can suck sometimes

Doctor: Swiftwater 4th isn’t real, it can’t hurt you

Swiftwater Last > Vigil Last > Upward Last > Borneo Last > Barnblitz Last

Swiftwater is the gold standard of last points imo. It’s super defendable for a team that holds their ground well, but they can also be overwhelmed in the best of positions by superior dm and coordination. Vigil is a close 2nd; its last overall is designed excellently, but it’s hurt majorly by how close the spawn exit is to the cap; it’s too easy to reestablish a hold even after being near-wiped as red. Upward, Borneo, and Barnblitz last are all shitshows in every sense of the word.

Visited family, I think my cat enjoyed having an open loft to hang out in.

@Kastaling said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

@darzie People used to say hurtful shit to my face all the time in real life and guess what I did? I got thicker skin. It requires much, much thinner skin to be able to handle someone saying something in a private discord that hardly affects you than to handle it getting said to your face.

Stop letting other people have power over you and your life will be much better.

I typed up a long fucking reply to this and then I realized it’s pretty off topic because fundamentally I don’t think policing private discords will be functional in a way that will help the league (which you seem to agree with to some extent).

Everything I said on slurs being hurtful has already been said previously, so I think we agree to disagree on what is an appropriate reaction to slurs in one’s own personal life.

Hit submit too soon, sorry.

“haver thicker skin” is an excuse bigots use to keep saying hurtful shit. It also in this context means “stop letting hurtful things hurt you” which no. I’m not gonna be quiet about hurtful things because again, people are saying those things to be hurtful.

I think policing private discords would be a fucking incredibly difficult task from the RGL side of things, but I also think it’s silly to say that people using bigoted language is good, fine, and not a reflection how they see others.

@wish said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

@darzie said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

Are you telling people who are tired of slurs to git gud so they have enough pull on teams?

Yes. You can be an extremely, openly toxic person and still find a team provided that you’re good enough. The inverse works too.

I feel like we can agree this is a bug and not a feature. Good players should not be able to be toxic just because they’re good, and bad players should not need to be good to be treated with respect.

Telling people they need to be good enough to force teams to accept them for not using slurs is just saying slurs are acceptable to use at low skill players.

@wish said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

@darzie said in Addressing Racism/Anti-LGBTQ Speech on Off-Platform Media:

You did not read my full post. If people are that invested in having you on their team that will probably work. However half the time people will tell they don’t actually care about having you in their team/pug group/whatever niche tf2 thing and continue doing whatever it is.

Sometimes asking will work. Sometimes it will not. Pretending asking will always work is a falsehood and doesn’t reflect the reality of what’s going on.

If you’re the best player available for a team, they will stop. I know this for a fact. Most people would rather win than say slurs.

Are you telling people who are tired of slurs to git gud so they have enough pull on teams?